Forums / Political & Legal / Border Patrol Checkpoint

5 years 19 weeks ago, 3:45 AM

runawaygun762

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So, I kinda doubt we have many lawyers here, but maybe one of the smart guys can help me with this. Going north on SR 90 from Sierra Vista toward Tucson, there is a Border Patrol checkpoint at which every vehicle is stopped and the question of "Are you a US citizen?" is asked. My question is this: Is this checkpoint legal? By going through a law enforcement checkpoint, am I not technically being detained without probable cause or reasonable suspicion? I personally don't care, as it gives me an opportunity for humor when I answer the question with some dumb, nonsensical spanish answer like (forgive my spelling) "La jaqueta es caliente en el bano" or "Dios bendiga a America, y nadia mas". I am sure I butchered the spelling there, but I know how to say it. Anyway, the only people who should be worried about a BP checkpoint are illegals, the only people who should worry about a DUI checkpoint are drunk drivers, the only people who should worry about a gun control checkpoint are gun owners, the only people who should worry about a literature checkpoint are people who own banned books, and so on. Is this a violation of our rights?

"I have always been a soldier. I have known no other life. The calling of arms, I have followed from boyhood. I have never sought another." From The Virtues of War, by Steven Pressfield.
5 years 19 weeks ago, 3:46 AM

runawaygun762

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Okay, new topic

read it and help, people.

"I have always been a soldier. I have known no other life. The calling of arms, I have followed from boyhood. I have never sought another." From The Virtues of War, by Steven Pressfield.
5 years 19 weeks ago, 4:33 AM

Anonymous

absofuckinlutely!if our government would grow some balls and station soldiers with automatic weapons at the borders with orders to shoot to kill there would not be any reason to have these check points stations within sovereign US territory!

5 years 19 weeks ago, 8:25 AM

charley9toe

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I believe them to be both legal and necesssary.
There are a number of US Codes that Fed LE can use in a checkpoint scenario. Immigration is one but remember they are also looking for other
violations as well. I believe the BP folks are now cross indoctrinated
(I believe Title 10) for "narco detection and process procedure" as well.
We have sobriety checkpoints around here all the time.

(You have to look behind all of that outer space stuff)
5 years 18 weeks ago, 9:30 PM

dbphotos

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They have been upheld by SCOTUS, just like drunk driving checkpoints, etc. While I'm all for protecting my individual rights, I'm o.k. with these public checkpoints. Like you said there are only a few people that should be worried about them. They still have to have PC to search your vehicle or detain you for an unreasonable amount of time.

Just don't be like this idiot! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=msFEj-UBU9Q

"God Bless Our Troops, Especially Our Snipers."
5 years 18 weeks ago, 10:11 PM

raffycanlas

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well you dont necessarily have to be american, but a lawful legal resident in america, which in this case, the illegal wetbacks aint.

I'm just another damn yankee with a loaded gun looking for some fun!
5 years 18 weeks ago, 9:00 AM

samD

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runaway

Had some out of town company Saturday, we were heading down 19 & past our "CheckPoint" in full swing. Nice sunny day all is cool. Had lunch and on the way North on 19 it had started raining. Guess what? All the Border Patrol was gone, I guess they didn't want to get wet! Well I think every Mexican with a cell phone was calling back across the border, come on in Jose, eets raining!

5 years 18 weeks ago, 9:06 AM

Gunnin88

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I have a friend Jake who was recently arrested outside of Yuma AZ, at one of these check point for possession of drugs (weed). Those checkpoints are not just for immigration they are also trying to find drugs. I personally believe they are a violation of our rights. To some one that is not from the area like Jake, they are surprise check points. It's no different than obeying the law while driving down the highway and getting pulled over for a random search. It's just wrong

01*20*2013 Obamas last day!
5 years 18 weeks ago, 7:49 PM

runawaygun762

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The checkpoint on SR90

isn't a stop and search CP. They ask if you're a US citizen and sometimes just wave you through. I realize we need border enforcement, but as this is a semi-permanent CP and everyone knows it's here, I can't see it being very effective. Unlike stopping murderers or nukes, the cost of the CP isn't justified by stopping a few illegals. I guess it makes some feel good about our Border Patrol, but I take the BP agents out and put State Troopers or ATF agents and it's a demonstration that the government can stop you at will.

"I have always been a soldier. I have known no other life. The calling of arms, I have followed from boyhood. I have never sought another." From The Virtues of War, by Steven Pressfield.
5 years 17 weeks ago, 3:26 PM

Reaper308

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checkpoints

they are perfectly legal and are upheld by SCOTUS (michigan dept of state police vs. Sitz... I think). Sitz claimed it was a violation of the 4th amendment, but the court said that the benefits of the CP out weighed the infringement. The CP on SR90 sounds very similar to the CP's at the CA/AZ border, Hoover Dam etc... They can be established for the purpose of looking for people legally operating motor vehicles, illegal immagrants, terrorists, non indigenous plants or vegetables, federally protected wildlife, or imbred troll transvestites who resemble the almighty chuck norris... but if any illegal contraband or activities are discovered, you can be arrested and prosecuted without probable cause/reasonable suspicion. Personally, I feel it is a little bit of an infringement, but the law is the law.

"Proelium Comminus Auctoritate" "Sometimes the light at the end of the tunnel is a muzzle flash."
5 years 17 weeks ago, 8:46 AM

Manny G

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I never stop at those check point. Those check points are voluntary. WTF is wrong with you people you are only suppose to stop if a police officer pull you over. Why are people pulling over for customs? Next thing you know the post man will be pulling people over to make sure you have the proper postage...

If you drive thru and ignore a customs check point not at a border what they can not ticket you for anything unless we are in Mashall law and/or police state...

Thank you
5 years 17 weeks ago, 10:14 AM

Reaper308

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Manny

if you drive through a checkpoint, you WILL be pulled over

"Proelium Comminus Auctoritate" "Sometimes the light at the end of the tunnel is a muzzle flash."
5 years 17 weeks ago, 10:49 AM

Manny G

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True you might get pulled over however you will get pulled over by a real police officer. As long as you did not break any moving violation the police will eventually let you go.

The fourth Amendment of the constitution guaranttees the right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects against unreasonable searches and seizures, SHALL NOT be violated etc...

If you use your common sense you will realize Customs in the middle of a state pulling people over is unreasonable....

Thank you
5 years 17 weeks ago, 11:34 AM

Manny G

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Serious Question about

Serious Question about Border checkpoint in the middle of the state; What kind of drugs was the governor tripping on when he authorized placing a Border Patrol Check point in the middle of the state?

Or were they all taking hits at the Governors crack house?

Fact is; a normal sober individual will never put a Border Checkpoint in the middle of any state. That is so silly and useless. Then you wonder where all billions and billions of dollars disappear to..

Thank you
5 years 17 weeks ago, 11:38 AM

samD

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Manny G

The checkpoint on I19 is after the border about 10 miles. It is at a chokepoint, that any illegals would have to travel through after sneaking in the country, if they have gotten a ride. I see it's viability, but question it's usefullness when abandoned because it is raining...

5 years 17 weeks ago, 12:07 PM

Manny G

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The only people impressed with those check point are the leaders under the influence of the crap. Only a really stupid person who is illegal would use that road. I guess United States of America does not use common sense anymore.

I am not impress when United States waste my hard earn tax dollars which I worked very hard for unless the AIG CEOs and Wall Street people that received hundreds of billions of your tax dollars as a THANK you bonus, Job well done…
California is famous for creating stupid laws for some unknown reason.

Thank you
5 years 17 weeks ago, 12:14 PM

Manny G

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What the hell why not put two or three more check points in the name of catching more illegals.

Wow that is a great idea. What the hell do these law makers have in their heads? Anyone know?

The reason Californians do not complain about the choke point because as they sit there in traffic with there thumbs up their butts they can take out the cell phone and make some phone calls as they sit there in traffic. Californians love crap like that. That is one of the reasons the check points are still in full operations…

Thank you
3 years 36 weeks ago, 8:43 PM

angles99

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Border Check Point

Today I waited over 30 minutes to get through the highway 90 checkpoint towards Benson Arizona. I travel through this checkpoint everyday to go home and now for almost 2 years I'm tired of it. When I finally got to the agent, the same question came up again; "Are you a U.S. Citizen"? I responding with "No Shit" and started to drive away. The Border Patrol agent grabbed my arm and stated "Stop", so I did and asked again if I was an U.S. Citizen; I again replied with "No Shit". By now, I'm pissed and had enough. He told me to pull over and I said no, I'm going to leave now; you can't detain a U.S. Citizen and he then replied that if I drove off that he would have me pulled over. I asked him what the problem was and he stated that I didn't answer his question so I replied with "Yes I did" I said no shit; just because you don't like my answer doesn't mean I didn't answer you. He said I needed to reply with an answer of "Yes" or I will have to pulled over. I then told him that I am a 28 Year Army retiree so if that didn't give this kid a clue; wow!!!!!!! I know these guys do a service for our State and Country but they should know that a retiree is a U.S. Citizen. Anyways, I had to pull over and the same kid (probably 21 years old, at the most) asked me again if I was a U.S. Citizen; now I'm really pissed off and said "I already told you". Being a veternan with PTSD, I'm starting to shake to where I started getting flashbacks of war. Here I am in my own country and being questioned over and over again if I was a U.S. Citizen. Finally after about 20 minutes pulled over to where he would stand in front of my truck so I couldn't drive off, the supervisor came over and asked this kid (agent) what the problem was. He responded with I wouldn't answer his question which was definately not the truth. When the supervisor asked me to answer the question, I then told him that I already did at 6 times. Then, the supervisor asked the agent if they checked my I.D. After 30 minutes now, they finally asked if I had an I.D. So I gladly showed them my retired U.S. Army 1SG ID and the "SUPERVISOR" stated that this is still not proof of my Citizenship. I then replied with anger "Are you F'ing kidding me"! You can't retire from our Armed Forces without being a citizen. He then replied with "my father and brother served and they're from Puerto Rico". I asked him how long did they serve and he replied with "One Term each". Wow, no wonder; it's not till you reach 6 years in the Army to where you have to become either a duel citizen or a full pledged citizen of the U.S. I do believe this situation could have been settled in minutes if first the kid can take any other answer than "Yes" as the only answer to his question and second, if all agents understood the service our Armed Forces are doing overseas and that when a retired Active Duty Card is presented, it's an automatic proof of citizenship. This Border check finally let me go after nearly an hour and I never did answer their question with "Yes". Before I left, the supervisor asked me if this will ever happen again and I said "Yes". I'm proud of this country and my service; along with all our heroes that serve. It sucks that American Citizens are being harrassed at Border Checks when the agent can use simple judgement and especially after many conversations in perfect English and plenty of signs and indicators that I was a citizen. I'm very upset with this Border Check and very angry with the way it is ran. The date and time I came through this check was 15 November 2010 around 04:30pm. Notice I did not mention any names.

3 years 36 weeks ago, 8:51 PM

angles99

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Feedback

I truly hope someone fixes the way they harrass citizens of this country. I could have given you names of both this kid or supervisor but decided it was not needed. I only wanted to express how I felt and wanted to also know if they could have pulled me over if I left the check point? I do not believe so but I could be wrong.

3 years 36 weeks ago, 11:07 PM

samD

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an impertinent pup, who couldn't carry your jock.
I had a similar incident with an ICE Officer (Bitch) at Nogales awhile back. I had forgotten my passport. She was a real smartass and nasty to me. I gave it right back to her and she didn't appreciate it. She wanted me to be scared because I forgot my passport. She mentioned taking me out of line and having me searched. I told her in no uncertain terms that I was a US Citizen and she alone would never get me out of line. She finally backed down and let me through. Today I came back from NOgo on 19 and stopped, I ahd rolled down all my windows as my Suburban has dark glass, the BP said thank you sir have a nice day, didn't even ask me if I was a citizen. Hard to figure...

3 years 36 weeks ago, 11:51 PM

Larry Wagner

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Gent's, Howdy!!

What's going on & how ya all doing?

Any day above dirt is a good day!!! My New Motto: Where Do I Sign? (Oh yes I would)
3 years 36 weeks ago, 11:56 PM

greg az

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Glad to have you aboard..Felt good to get that off your chest huh..ha ha,

Brother did 20 (retired mustang) then another 20 down in Greeley Hall (where i assume you work) before retiring some years ago.. The logic of having the road check point is lost on me.. This is as logical as the nightly pictures of the TSA women doing those hokey pat downs on the blond California valley girl..

Few years back the wife and i took a trip up to Yellowstone, Our first visit to the park, and a great experiance that was marred by an overbearing park guard (a whiskey) who wanted to see our receipt on the way OUT of the park.. I'll make this short, you can't get in with out paying.. period, (unless you 4 wheel thru the Tetons).. We had all the park literature that ONLY comes with the admission fee.. This became an issue as i couldn't find it, and she was going to show her "power" over this grey haired senior.. Like yourself an alpha vet, and WAY not good (or familiar) with being punked.. My wife found the slip at about the same time my eyeballs started to roll back in my head.. The next 20 min are gone.. Not kidding, and not proud of it, just fact.. Combine stupidity, with a bullying fool in a uniform and you have our little adventure.. I didn't report our "adventure" either.. Good call on your part, moral high grounds not the easiest but best.. Course a broken nose works ok to..

a man has to hold his word, hold his beliefs, and hold a good sight picture.
3 years 36 weeks ago, 11:59 PM

Larry Wagner

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Ok, see ya.

Later!

Any day above dirt is a good day!!! My New Motto: Where Do I Sign? (Oh yes I would)
3 years 36 weeks ago, 3:11 AM

luckybychoice

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bet those guys

all learned a lesson,see why i think teachers should get more pay,you guys set 'em straight for free.

i tried being reasonable,i didn't like it, NRA LIFE MEMBER,USMC VETERAN

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