Forums / Off Topic / Food for thought...

4 years 6 weeks ago, 2:52 PM

ronin1604

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Food for thought...

On Thursday, May 27, 1999, Darrell Scott, the father of Rachel Scott, a victim of the Columbine High School shootings in Littleton, Colorado, addressed a subcommittee of the House Judiciary Committee. He pointed out that the first recorded act of violence occurred when Cain slew his brother Abel:

“The villain was not the club he used. Neither was it the ... the National Club Association. The true killer was Cain, and the reason for the murder could only be found in Cain’s heart.”

He went on to say,

“In the days that followed the Columbine tragedy, I was amazed at how quickly fingers began to be pointed at groups such as the NRA [National Rifle Association]. I am not a member of the NRA. I am not a hunter. I do not even own a gun. I am not here to represent or defend the NRA because I don’t believe that they are responsible for my daughter’s death. Therefore I do not believe that they need to be defended.”

He added,

“When something as terrible as Columbine’s tragedy occurs, politicians immediately look for a scapegoat such as the NRA. They immediately seek to pass more restrictive laws that erode away our personal and private liberties. We do not need more restrictive laws. Eric and Dylan [perpetrators of the Columbine massacre] would not have been stopped by metal detectors. No amount of gun laws can stop someone who spends months planning this type of massacre.... Political posturing and restrictive legislation are not the answers.”

Seems to me he has the right idea.

__________________ "...He that hath no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one." - Jesus, Luke 22:36
4 years 6 weeks ago, 3:23 PM

greg az

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Darrell Scott.. Guys a real hero.. Natural to blame anyone and everyone for the loss of a child.. sure he isolated himself from others in saying that.. Colorado is (some sections to include sub's of Denver) close to as liberal as CA, ME, or WA. so since he's not NRA connected this was from the heart and obviously logical..

I doubt that many of us watch the news, and don't wonder what can be done about violence.. The nation is changing.. FOX had a big deal about the up coming use of drones to spy on citizens.. Illegal but were heading down that road.. Gloria and i watched this story unfold yesterday, she says "i don't have a problem with it".. Fact is there's a HUGE problem with it.. Soon as we let the gov have that power were screwed.. This is scary.. i thought about deleting some of this.. I do think we have to be aware of the obvious.. and actually im not as uncomfortable with a site like ours being monitored.. i think thats logical.. as the use of drones to collect info on the populace.. get those tin foil hats out guys..

a man has to hold his word, hold his beliefs, and hold a good sight picture.
4 years 6 weeks ago, 3:50 PM

jay sedler

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thanks ronin

i must try to find that video!

CRY HAVOC and let slip the dogs of war!
4 years 6 weeks ago, 4:44 PM

Nitris

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Agree, he does have the right idea.

Ron Paul 2012 III
4 years 6 weeks ago, 5:02 PM

jay sedler

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this is what he said:

On Thursday, Darrell Scott, the father of Rachel Scott, a victim of the Columbine High School shootings in Littleton, Colorado, was invited to address the House Judiciary Committee's subcommittee. What he said to our national leaders during this special session of Congress was painfully truthful. They were not prepared for what he was to say, nor was it received well. It needs to be heard by every parent, every teacher, every politician, every sociologist, every psychologist, and every so-called expert! These courageous words spoken by Darrell Scott are powerful, penetrating, and deeply personal. There is no doubt that God sent this man as a voice crying in the wilderness. The following is a portion of the transcript:

"Since the dawn of creation there has been both good & evil in the hearts of men and women. We all contain the seeds of kindness or the seeds of violence. The death of my wonderful daughter, Rachel Joy Scott, and the deaths of that heroic teacher, and the other eleven children who died must not be in vain. Their blood cries out for answers.

"The first recorded act of violence was when Cain slew his brother Abel out in the field. The villain was not the club he used. Neither was it the NCA, the National Club Association. The true killer was Cain, and the reason for the murder could only be found in Cain's heart.

"In the days that followed the Columbine tragedy, I was amazed at how quickly fingers began to be pointed at groups such as the NRA. I am not a member of the NRA. I am not a hunter. I do not even own a gun. I am not here to represent or defend the NRA - because I don't believe that they are responsible for my daughter's death. Therefore I do not believe that they need to be defended. If I believed they had anything to do with Rachel's murder I would be their strongest opponent.

"I am here today to declare that Columbine was not just a tragedy-it was a spiritual event that should be forcing us to look at where the real blame lies! Much of the blame lies here in this room. Much of the blame lies behind the pointing fingers of the accusers themselves. "I wrote a poem just four nights ago that expresses my feelings best. This was written way before I knew I would be speaking here today:

Your laws ignore our deepest needs, Your words are empty air. You've stripped away our heritage, You've outlawed simple prayer. Now gunshots fill our classrooms, And precious children die. You seek for answers everywhere, And ask the question "Why?" You regulate restrictive laws, Through legislative creed. And yet you fail to understand, That God is what we need!
"Men and women are three-part beings. We all consist of body, soul, and spirit. When we refuse to acknowledge a third part of our make-up, we create a void that allows evil, prejudice, and hatred to rush in and reek havoc. Spiritual presences were present within our educational systems for most of our nation's history. Many of our major colleges began as theological seminaries. This is a historical fact. What has happened to us as a nation? We have refused to honor God, and in so doing, we open the doors to hatred and violence. And when something as terrible as Columbine's tragedy occurs - politicians immediately look for a scapegoat such as the NRA. They immediately seek to pass more restrictive laws that contribute to erode away our personal and private liberties. We do not need more restrictive laws. "Eric and Dylan would not have been stopped by metal detectors. No amount of gun laws can stop someone who spends months planning this type of massacre. The real villain lies within our own hearts. Political posturing and restrictive legislation are not the answers. The young people of our nation hold the key. There is a spiritual awakening taking place that will not be squelched! We do not need more religion. We do not need more gaudy television evangelists spewing out verbal religious garbage. We do not need more million dollar church buildings built while people with basic needs are being ignored. We do need a change of heart and a humble acknowledgment that this nation was founded on the principle of simple trust in God!

"As my son Craig lay under that table in the school library and saw his two friends murdered before his very eyes-He did not hesitate to pray in school. I defy any law or politician to deny him that right! I challenge every young person in America, and around the world, to realize that on April 20, 1999, at Columbine High School prayer was brought back to our schools. Do not let the many prayers offered by those students be in vain. Dare to move into the new millennium with a sacred disregard for legislation that violates your God-given right to communicate with Him. To those of you who would point your finger at the NRA - I give to you a sincere challenge. Dare to examine your own heart before casting the first stone! My daughter's death will not be in vain! The young people of this country will not allow that to happen!"

CRY HAVOC and let slip the dogs of war!
4 years 6 weeks ago, 7:30 PM

Saint J.M. Browning

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Wow

Powerful stuff there. We need about a hundred million more of this guy.

"I don't think Hank done it this way" - Waylon
4 years 6 weeks ago, 7:38 PM

Vaquero

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Amen

Amen

The truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth!
4 years 6 weeks ago, 7:46 PM

Vaquero

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Meanwhile

The "chosen one" tries to turn our beloved country into Sodom and Gamorrah. If I step on toes then move yer fucking feet! I rue the day that insulent bastard got elected. I rue the day he was born. GOD will have no mercy on those who follow obama! I pray for our country and pray that the voting public will have the scales removed from their eyes. By all that is righteous and true I implore GOD, the Son and the Holy Spirit to make it so! AMEN

The truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth!
4 years 6 weeks ago, 8:02 PM

Saint J.M. Browning

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Amen!

Well said, Vaq!

"I don't think Hank done it this way" - Waylon
4 years 6 weeks ago, 8:08 PM

greg az

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Wow..

Why didn't we hear these words before now.. Powerful and on the money huh..

I didn't really care that much about "open marriage".. guess it was a hold over from my days as a liberal .. i still question if it's a homosexuals "fault" or not.. just don't know.. what i do know is this is one thing that is SO covered in the Bible.. The Bible doesn't exactly "fence set" on this one guys..

Never been that much about "organized" religion,. but you do have to have a moral compass.. The Bible makes the whole gay thing what it really is.. Perverted.. This is a hard one for me.. as i still don't buy that some aren't just orientated that way.. thing is the % of any population thats homosexual.. (see that sounds like hate, cause were indoctrinated to use "gay") has and always will remain constant.. but when you ok it.. then experimentation takes over, and i can tell you from women in prison that it's only the "taboo" of it that keeps the % down in the male population.. Due we want that.. Our young men not having "stigma" related to being homosexual.. Thats where were heading..

I still buy into legal rights, and yeah i think for most it's genetic as opposed to choice.. Guessing most of those who prefer their own sex would prefer not to.. but if we make it legal marriage.. then it's just one more trip down the slippery slope of moral decay.. It's to the point now that if you "question" anything that the left/media says is ok, then your branded either hater or bigot.. I know thiers a lot of things in the bible that are not reflective of todays world.. I also know that this (and sex with animals) is the one thing thats "absolute".. the Bible doesn't "ok" slavery, or multiple marriage.. I'm on my second page to page of old and new.. and nope.. mentions them, but does NOT ok them.. the issue of perversion is absolute..

Sorry to get serious here.. course i was thinking of ebear and laughing as we all do.. but thats fundamental to this.. yeah we laugh, but it's only funny because we know .. duh.. ok.. bottom line, we have to either have a moral compass or not.. In a lot of ways the issue of "gay" marriage is at the heart of this..

a man has to hold his word, hold his beliefs, and hold a good sight picture.
4 years 6 weeks ago, 8:53 PM

Saint J.M. Browning

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More of my 2¢

Since we're on the whole gay marriage thing, I'd like to post what I wrote on my blog about this:

Let me start with acknowledging that I am a conservative and straight and I don't believe that gay marriage should be allowed. Having said that, it is probably not for the reason whomever is reading this may think.

I do not have any problem with homosexuality at all. I don't understand it, and I realize that is because my attraction is to the opposite sex and I would never understand the attraction to one's own gender. But I do believe in love and I do understand that. And I don't have a problem with people that love each other declaring their unending commitment to their partner. It's a beautiful thing and the world needs more of it.

But I am curious why homosexuals want to get married. Does the state's official recognition make a difference? Why be concerned over whether it is recognized by any government? It's almost better that the government doesn't get involved in your union so as to regulate this union and the choices you may make.

Is it for the shared benefits? Whether employer or social? Civil union and domestic partnerships have been offered and even currently exist in areas and companies. But for some reason this isn't enough. What is it supporters really want?
Acknowledgment? Then you are an attention whore. If it were really about love between two people, the only acknowledgment that matters is between the couple in question.

But I don't mean to judge. Really, I don't. I think that the real issue here isn't whether same-sex marriages should be legal, but more that this whole issue has exposed the fact that the government has interfered into what is a religious institution. Marriage originated from religion in all cultures and beliefs. Ignoring other cultures' and governments'
involvement into this institution, the US government's recognition of this religious practice blurs the separation of church and state.

And this includes marriage by those of opposite sex. The government needs to re-define it's acknowledgment of the bond of love between two people and maintain a difference between the state recognized civil union and the religious marriage.

Please, when you encounter a person that says they are opposed to same-gender marriage, understand they might have a legitimate and rational reason for this. All of us that are in opposition are not necessarily bigoted and/or homophobic. Or bible thumpers. Or right-wing extremists.

"I don't think Hank done it this way" - Waylon
4 years 6 weeks ago, 9:40 PM

daisycutter

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I am not a conspiracy guy at all.
I do believe the homosexual assault on the religious covenant of marriage is another phase in erasing religious belief from our society.
By making a mockery of the institution which exists to produce and protect children homosexuals and their atheist butt buddies are taking one more brick out of the wall.
The atheists have almost rewritten the constitution, it is stunning how many people now believe that the "separation of church and state" actially exists in the constitution. Indeed, the federal judiciary meddling in matters of faith is in itself a violation of the constitution isn't it?
Religious beliefs and liberalism do not easily mix so those who cling to their beliefs are under attack.

This is another one of "those" topics I should steer clear of. :<)

iyaoyas
4 years 6 weeks ago, 9:50 PM

Saint J.M. Browning

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OK, Daisy, maybe 5¢

Yes, much of what you say is where I'm coming from. That novella was an excerpt from my blog and I try to tone it down so I can spread truth to liberals instead of immediately attack them and getting them on the defensive. The mind closes at that point.
But I really think the gay marriage issue exposes the fact that the government shouldn't be involved in marriage at all. Gay or otherwise.
From the beginning of written history, marriage has been a religious institution. And I was trying to point out to supporters of gay marriage (because I sent them a link to that) that there was no benefit to a government recognized same-gender marriage. It essentially boils down to they want attention and/or validation.
My fear with the government expanding their definition of marriage is multifaceted. One big possibility is that if they provide "protections" for same-gender marriage, they open a door to force churches (and synagogues, and mosques) to go against it's own beliefs. Also, as someone else mentioned, where does the line end? The polygamists will surely be next. Then you will have pedophiles arguing for recognition, then bestiality, then love dolls.
I agree with you on the 1st amendment issue too. Too often rulings are made that a christian (somehow it's always a christian) has violated someone's 1st amendment right by exposing them to religion. How this interpretation started and has ever been accepted is beyond me. There are a few clauses to the 1st. Two of them people have labeled as the founders' attempt at bringing Jefferson's Separation of Church and State as quoted from his letter to the Danbury Baptist Association in 1802. The establishment clause: "Congress shall make no law respecting the establishment of religion"
This is the one the commies like to abuse. But I don't get how wearing a crucifix is congress making a law. But some advocate judge does and people accept the ruling. The other is the free exercise: "nor prohibit the free exercise thereof". But they sure do ignore that part, don't they? It's inconvenient for their agenda. But, again, the point of that has been warped. In Jefferson's letter, he stated the purpose was to prevent government from interfering in religion.

"I don't think Hank done it this way" - Waylon
4 years 6 weeks ago, 11:32 PM

jay sedler

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saint and daisy

i like what you both say,and I'm torn between your stance and another call it a 3 way(haha)
i belive in gay rights,i think its queer,i don't like it don't agree,but if they leave me out of it i don't mind.

MARRIAGE has always been man and woman: one man one woman= marriage
one man+woman+woman= man married to 2 women,not 2 woman married,and also married to a man

to say gays should not be legally united in some way i think is as wrong as saying two people one black,one white cannot unite, however the difference is its always been called married when its a man and a woman of any color

heres where the gay marriage thing loses in my LOGICAL MIND if the word red means RED the word woman means WOMAN man means MAN man+woman means MARRIAGE you can't just re wright the language suddenly! men marry women,women marry men and gays do SOMTHING ELSE!!!!!!!!! married IS TAKEN, it already has a meaning,and that meaning has been used for thousands of years! if gays can get married,then joe bob can murder,because HE and HIS FRIENDS decide murder isn't the right word......maybe they will call it pillow fight,no law against pillow fights right?
how do you keep track,and more importantly who would if the rules constantly change?

CRY HAVOC and let slip the dogs of war!
4 years 6 weeks ago, 1:09 AM

greg az

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atheist butt buddies

Doubt if i'll ever have an occasion to say that again, and just wanted to make the most of it..

Nope Daisy..This is NOT another one of "those" topics you should steer clear of.. To be honest i would think that those who are "gay" (gay is just easier and doesn't sound quite as "harsh" as homoatheistbuttbuddy..as you age you have to take anything over the plate) have a preconceived notion that any conservative gun sight would be a bunch of haters.. Just another reason im proud to know you guys.. Everything above (with possible exception to ABB's) is fair, and i believe supportive to individual choice, and legal rights of legitimate couples..

Jay has it spot on with the redefining of terms.. and actually this does leave the door open to marriage being defined as what ever you want to be married to.. Consequently it's only a matter of time till the law of magnetic north kicks in..i'm talking about the 3 or 4 degrees difference that represents magnetic north compared to true North.. About how far "off" al least 25% of America is, and the re-defined world of marriage will soon extend to "pets" are perhaps "stuff".. There have been times that i've had fond feelings for ferns.. but i don't want to marry one of them..

a man has to hold his word, hold his beliefs, and hold a good sight picture.
4 years 6 weeks ago, 7:52 AM

bad landing47

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Darrell Scott

An intelligent thoughtful man, but I'm afraid just a voice in the wilderness of liberal Colorado.
About this gay marriage thing It has been promoted by Hollywood and liberal talking heads. Marraige between two men or two women is morally repugnant to all mainstream religions and even primitive tribes know it isn't right. Do they know something liberals don't. Civil unions would be acceptable to me to allow certain priveleges like inheritance, power of attorney etc. for committed partners. There is no reason for gay marriage except to legitamize something to make the gays feel better about themselves. Hollywood promotes gays as talented fun loving, harmless folks when in reality that is often not the truth. The same Hollywood that promotes drug use, tattos and piercings, having children befor marraige et. al. 50,000 Mexicans are dead now from the cartels because we buy their drugs here. I know I'm an old fart like Greg AZ but in my day only military and bikers got tattoos, no one would have thought of piercings, got a girl pregnant you were getting married or else, and it was don't ask don't tell about gays.

4 years 6 weeks ago, 7:59 AM

ronin1604

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With this thing is that I have to agree with Greg. Obama said that his Christian faith led him to evolve his belief on gay marriage. This is pure B.S! Like Greg said, this is one of the areas where the bible doesn't straddle the fence. I disagree with gay "marriage", in that marriage is a religious concept in a religion that dis-approves of it. If 2 people of the same sex want to live in union, that is their business, but it isn't "marriage".

__________________ "...He that hath no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one." - Jesus, Luke 22:36
4 years 6 weeks ago, 11:54 AM

daisycutter

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the rest of us do AND NO MORE than the rest of us!!!!!!!!! Neither do negroes, mexicans, women or any other "Privileged" minority.
What the hell benefit are homosexuals to the military? What can they offer that any other service member cannot? Why the hell did the Navy decide they needed to put a picture of lesbians sucking each other's tongues in front of the families of normal people and the world?
Live and let live until some assholes start taking OUR rights away so they can have MORE!
Shit, It's good I have a lot of work to get done. Assholes.

iyaoyas
4 years 6 weeks ago, 4:10 PM

jay sedler

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daisy, i agree

my last comment on the homo thing.
why can they refer to us as "breeders" with a negative implication,but if we call them queer meaning strange, or shorten homosexual witch they are to homo we could be trampling their rights and depending on the situation be guilty of a "hate crime"?

why do we have to constantly defend our 2nd amendment that was written plain as day,but everyone wants to help them gain something they were never guaranteed in the constitution?

im baffled

CRY HAVOC and let slip the dogs of war!
4 years 6 weeks ago, 1:23 PM

greg az

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Serious here.. It's not that hard.. O sat on the political fence here, then at the risk of losing his "rainbow coalition" support, jumped in.. lied about motives "faith".. yeah right.. The "faith" was in the political advisor urging action on it.

Badland'n (and honestly all of us) have this one nailed with the.."no reason for gay marriage except to legitimize something to make the gays feel better about themselves"

Heres the deal.. We really are a group of Patriots, not trying to break any of our arms with back patting.. Consider the following.. our resident chief curmudgeon (RCC?) is Daisy..

Should POTUS call RCC.. Some sort of "outreach to conservative Vets".. The ONLY person on this fictitious conference call with sincerity would be Daisy.. While we might question his politics, and the sincerity of his motives, he is POTUS and the reality of being a Patriot is our respect to the office. I would wager that he's surrounded by "advisers" who have less real respect for his position than we do..

a man has to hold his word, hold his beliefs, and hold a good sight picture.
4 years 6 weeks ago, 8:00 AM

MattyTheJet

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Ahhh

Common sense! How refreshing!

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