Forums / Gun Discussion / Grips

5 years 50 weeks ago, 7:18 AM

Kerryod

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Grips

My eldest has to review a film and is getting annoyed because the actors are using a grip that I say is difficult to aim with and almost impossible to let off more than one round with any reliability in getting an accurate shot.

Could I have everyone elses opinion to the below and any other faults shown on TV or film that really upset them

The firearm -generally small arm pistol - is held in one hand but rather than the sights being at the top the firearm (12 O'Clock) is held at a 45 degree angle (9 O'Clock) while being discharged.

Thanks

5 years 50 weeks ago, 7:24 AM

samD

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How can you sight point, when you can't see the sight?

90 degrees is sometimes taught for very close fighting or if you in prone and trying to be discreet.

Black & Mexican gangsta wannabes always turn 'em sideways, cuz they think it makes em cool. Yeah cold to the touch in the morgue, because they would lose in a firefight!

5 years 50 weeks ago, 7:50 AM

ronin1604

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Come on SamD...

Don't you know that turning it like that makes you more accurate, and it also adds 10 rounds to the magazine! LOL! We had a gunstore here put " Hommie Sights" on a gold and matte Deasert Eagle .50. They mounted the sights on the side of the slide. Did it as more of a joke then anything and it sold first day it was on display, and they had A LOT of request for more. I swear, todays youths....

__________________ "...He that hath no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one." - Jesus, Luke 22:36
5 years 50 weeks ago, 7:54 AM

samD

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But I love my Glock. It may be ugly but it works perfectly, I don't fumble for a safety and it generally hits what I point it towards.
I met a genrleman yesterday at dog training class, he was carrying a CZ (open carry) and said he carries a 1911, and two other pistols of various makes and models, no two the same. I am thinking to self, self how the hell does he remember where all the safeties are?
My Glock, I draw, point and squeeze, no muss no fuss.

5 years 50 weeks ago, 5:18 PM

runawaygun762

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I have heard

although I have not been able to confirm anywhere, that canting the pistol and using the edge of the slide as an aiming device was a close-kill technique that was taught in the army for a while when they used the 1911, due to the GI sights being so small and hard to see. I know that many schools nowadays teach canting your pistol when firing one handed, as it allows a your hand to be at a neutral position, rather than pronated or supinated, which lets more muscles come into controlling the gun. I doubt the gang bangers started doing this out of the blue, I'm sure someone, somewhere, learned some variation of this and took it back to the 'hood. Me personally, I have tried this while fucking around with my toys (read that, safely and responsibly enjoying the shooting sports), and couldn't hit a fucking thing. Oh well, guess I'll have to take off the bandanna, unroll the pant leg, stop repasen-in', and use those sights.

"I have always been a soldier. I have known no other life. The calling of arms, I have followed from boyhood. I have never sought another." From The Virtues of War, by Steven Pressfield.
5 years 49 weeks ago, 1:30 PM

cbxjeff

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Gangsta

I'm way too old to keep up with the latest street scene. I'm also not a MD but thinking about this, consider holding a few pounds at arms length. My wrist is stronger when subjected to a weight in the "normal" firing position compare to rotating it to hold the weight as they do in the hood.

It's too late for me, save yourself.
5 years 49 weeks ago, 1:36 PM

runawaygun762

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Not true, cbxjeff

If you slowly rotate your wrist and look at your shoulder, you'll see that when using a normal firing grip, you use almost entirely your front deltoid muscle, whereas if you rotate to a neutral position, you bring in some of your middle deltoid. The emphasis on a neutral grip is not holding the gun, it's managing recoil and as far as that goes, you can physically control recoil better with a neutral grip. I'm not an advocate of it, as you have to adjust your point of aim from what most of us are used to, but it does have merits.

"I have always been a soldier. I have known no other life. The calling of arms, I have followed from boyhood. I have never sought another." From The Virtues of War, by Steven Pressfield.
5 years 49 weeks ago, 1:37 PM

Ebear

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i would say this

with the much lighter poly's it is possible to shoot gangsta style, but is allot harder to run away with your pants fallin down at the ass.

...check... G-AZ
5 years 49 weeks ago, 3:08 PM

cbxjeff

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Gangsta

OK, I didn't consider recoil for multi shots. The dynamics of this gets pretty complicated. My post was just about the strength of my wrist in two axis. I can hold a weight at arms length in the normal config better than the hood config. Maybe I'm weird, but it's got nothing to do with my wrist strength!

It's too late for me, save yourself.
5 years 49 weeks ago, 3:10 PM

Ebear

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but

runaways' sex life is all wrist strength

...check... G-AZ
5 years 49 weeks ago, 3:37 PM

Schuyler

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from hanging onto the horns.

"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke
5 years 49 weeks ago, 11:26 AM

Kerryod

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When men were men and sheep were worried, (especially when they saw the 'wellies')

5 years 49 weeks ago, 11:32 AM

samD

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"When in doubt, the safe intercourse should be taken"

Hope all is well, how is the politicking coming?

5 years 49 weeks ago, 11:41 AM

Kerryod

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Hello my old mucker!

How's you Trouble?

Or

'Familitary breeds contempt or Familitary just breeds'

Sorry folks this is getting slighly rude or as dirty as the mind that reads it.

The Politics are going well but Security is more fun, you don't have to be nice to everyone.

Have a wonderful evening everyone and I look forward to the 5th June when I have more time to chat to everyone. I'm on facebook as well (please don't all cringe at once)if anyone wants to visit http://profile.to/kerryod/

Hugs to everyone

Kerry

5 years 49 weeks ago, 11:53 AM

samD

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Try again please.

5 years 49 weeks ago, 12:02 PM

Kerryod

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Arh doesn't it?

Sorry, Just go to facebook and search for Kerry O'Donoghue, you'll find me there.

5 years 49 weeks ago, 3:39 PM

Ebear

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well you know

i love the physical stuff

...check... G-AZ
5 years 49 weeks ago, 3:54 PM

cbxjeff

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Gangsta

ebear, as a new guy, I don't need that much info about our members!!!

It's too late for me, save yourself.
5 years 49 weeks ago, 3:57 PM

runawaygun762

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cbxjeff

as an older guy, i can say you can't avoid it. Much like ebear's family, he's everywhere

"I have always been a soldier. I have known no other life. The calling of arms, I have followed from boyhood. I have never sought another." From The Virtues of War, by Steven Pressfield.
5 years 49 weeks ago, 11:42 AM

Kerryod

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Runaway

Oh come on, you are as old as the woman you are feeling!!!

5 years 49 weeks ago, 4:00 PM

Ebear

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cbxjeff

just so you know member information ,like chlorophorm and candy in runaway's glove box will always be available.

...check... G-AZ
5 years 49 weeks ago, 4:15 PM

Schuyler

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on a tag clipped to his ear. You know, inventory and all that.

"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke
5 years 49 weeks ago, 4:18 PM

runawaygun762

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I've only got a little left after that Boyscout Jamboree.

"I have always been a soldier. I have known no other life. The calling of arms, I have followed from boyhood. I have never sought another." From The Virtues of War, by Steven Pressfield.
5 years 49 weeks ago, 4:28 PM

cbxjeff

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Grips

OK, I'm new, but you guys are a hoot! Bear with me, I need some time, but I'll catch on.

It's too late for me, save yourself.
5 years 49 weeks ago, 4:47 PM

runawaygun762

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Careful, cbxjeff

You hang around ebear too long and you'll catch something.

"I have always been a soldier. I have known no other life. The calling of arms, I have followed from boyhood. I have never sought another." From The Virtues of War, by Steven Pressfield.
5 years 49 weeks ago, 5:13 PM

runawaygun762

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Kerryod

Here ya go, if you haven't seen it already

http://www.gunslot.com/pictures/homeboy-weapon-systems

"I have always been a soldier. I have known no other life. The calling of arms, I have followed from boyhood. I have never sought another." From The Virtues of War, by Steven Pressfield.
5 years 49 weeks ago, 11:24 AM

Kerryod

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Thanks

Thanks I've just had a look.

5 years 49 weeks ago, 6:52 PM

cbxjeff

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Grips

762, am I protected by antibiotics?

It's too late for me, save yourself.
5 years 49 weeks ago, 3:42 AM

charley9toe

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Grip at 45degree cant

I have heard that "professionals" train that way. I don't exactly understand the use of "professional" in that context. I've never been able to track that to earth. I think if you hold a pistol like that you can visualize more area.
That doesn't mean you are going to hit anything. I also believe in a very high stress scenario you will react to the position you are most trained in(we hope). Let's see now, everything just went in to slow motion. Where does Mickey have his hands on the clock at ?

(You have to look behind all of that outer space stuff)
5 years 49 weeks ago, 4:03 AM

charley9toe

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45Degree Cant

I mentioned a high stress scenario and everything just went into slow motion.
For those uninitiated, the condition is referred to as "tachypsychia".

(You have to look behind all of that outer space stuff)
5 years 49 weeks ago, 5:49 PM

cbxjeff

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Grips

You guys are BAD!

It's too late for me, save yourself.
5 years 49 weeks ago, 11:34 PM

runawaygun762

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charley9toe

I have trained using a 45 degree cant for some applications. When acting as a shield man for an entry team, it's nearly impossible to keep the pistol straight up and down while trying to aim through the view port, so we cant the gun. I have also trained one handed while canting, but for a right handed shooter it requires aiming low and right on the target and that is difficult to remember while doing stressfire training, as I am so used to the normal position. There are some uses, but they are pretty limited.

"I have always been a soldier. I have known no other life. The calling of arms, I have followed from boyhood. I have never sought another." From The Virtues of War, by Steven Pressfield.
5 years 42 weeks ago, 4:34 PM

daisycutter

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Pistol Hold

I've been shooting in competition since the early '60's and have not seen the sideways hold used. The first time I did see it was in a tought guy Steven Seagull movie. That was after Hollyweird taught us that shooting a car with a 9mm pistol would cause a monster explosion hurling the car 25 feet into the air.
Holding your gun sideways can cause death or serious injury just as any other mishandling can and will.

iyaoyas
5 years 42 weeks ago, 8:15 AM

runawaygun762

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Daisycutter

I doubt you've used a shield in competition. Again, it is uesful for some applications

"I have always been a soldier. I have known no other life. The calling of arms, I have followed from boyhood. I have never sought another." From The Virtues of War, by Steven Pressfield.
5 years 42 weeks ago, 8:39 AM

daisycutter

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Shield

You're 100% right, no combat pistol shootin' here. Anyone hear what Massad Ayoob has to say about it?

iyaoyas
5 years 40 weeks ago, 3:13 PM

daisycutter

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Early on, I did a series for the magazine on basics of shooting rifle, handgun, and shotgun. This is where it probably came from. Might be ten years ago or more. Don't recall it at the moment.

Sorry I couldn't be of more help. Basically, the "gangsta" position tracks recoil violently toward the shooter's non dominant side, is very difficult to control, and may account for why those who use it hit so many innocent bystanders.

Cordially,
Mas

iyaoyas

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