Forums / Political & Legal / LET'S GET PRACTICAL----RE THE UN SMALL ARMS TREATY

3 years 45 weeks ago, 3:20 PM

LLE

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When I was a teenage wise-ass, my grandfather would occasionally take me aside, and administer some hard won wisdom. One discussion centered on using your time and brain- power well and wisely. His favorite saying, along those lines was, "don't waste your time goosing ghosts". He added--"get the facts as well as you can, then use your brain to come to a REASONABLE conclusion."

Here is what I think I know:

ANY proposed treaty must be analyzed by the Senate Foreign Relations Sub-committee. This analysis must incude whether the proposed Treaty would or might violate U S Statutes............
FOR EXAMPLE: The proposed Treaty DIRECTLY contravenes the Second Amendment of the US Constitution. Therefore, if the sub- committee were to recomend it to the full Senate for ratification, the Second Amedment would have to have been struck down or modified by proper Legislative and/or Judicial process. [That could take many, many years to accomplish]. Failing that, the USA, by law, could not BE a legal signitory to the UN Treaty even IF the POTUS signed off on it, and wants to risk years of litigation if he issues an "Executive Order".

I REALIZE all of the above presupposes that the USA is still operating UNDER THE RULE OF LAW. If not----God help us all. We all should be vigilant, and put as much political pressure where it will do the most good, but IMHO, it is not time to send out Paul Revere II---YET!!

Too old to fight, Too old to run, guess that's why I carry a gun! "would someone show this asshole the way out of town".[Rabbi Avram Belinski-aka "The Frisco Kid"]
3 years 45 weeks ago, 5:18 AM

MattyTheJet

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Rules of Law?

Long abandoned in the District of Communism.

3 years 44 weeks ago, 3:02 PM

LLE

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SCAREY STUFF: There are some pundits who believe that because the USA is a signitory to the 1969 Vienna Convention onThe Law of International Treaties, THAT has already pre-empted our cherished Second Amendment. In order for that tortured logic to be valid, you would have to believe that our ENTIRE Constitution was pre-empted, including the provisions that require a Senate ratification vote after the Senate Foreign Relations committee recommends that the treaty is NOT violative of our laws.

IF Clinton does sign off on 7/27/12, she must do so [as provided for in the Vienna Convention] on the basis that her signiture is CONTINGENT upon ratification by the Senate, or she will have violated Federal law and be subject to potentially severe penalties.
THAT would fit very well with the recent behavior we have been treated to, from the high level Obama dead-end gang bangers, like the Attorney General, and the seemingly mentally- challenged senate majority leader.
FEAR NOT: IN GOD, WE TRUST

Too old to fight, Too old to run, guess that's why I carry a gun! "would someone show this asshole the way out of town".[Rabbi Avram Belinski-aka "The Frisco Kid"]
3 years 44 weeks ago, 3:58 PM

LLE

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error

No Comment

Too old to fight, Too old to run, guess that's why I carry a gun! "would someone show this asshole the way out of town".[Rabbi Avram Belinski-aka "The Frisco Kid"]
3 years 44 weeks ago, 7:01 PM

luckybychoice

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vienna

Yes but...clinton signs,obama is re...re....lect...man fuck it.check out dick morris.

i tried being reasonable,i didn't like it, NRA LIFE MEMBER,USMC VETERAN
3 years 44 weeks ago, 7:26 PM

Vaquero

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vienna

And Dick Morris

According to Morris if the treaty is signed, but not brought up for a vote in the senate and not renounced by the prez, then it has the force of law. He says that's what they plan to do since they won't be able to get it through the senate.

The truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth!
3 years 44 weeks ago, 7:37 PM

luckybychoice

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right

Thanks vaq

i tried being reasonable,i didn't like it, NRA LIFE MEMBER,USMC VETERAN
3 years 44 weeks ago, 7:45 PM

Vaquero

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No prob Lucky

BTW. ALL of my representatives have heard from me. How about the rest of y'all?
Yep, I did the polls, the NRA questionaires, etc. etc.........
But the Senators and my Congressman have heard from me personally. If they fail, I take it personally.

This crap is beyond humorous or annoying.

I found a signature line on another forum, it reads,
"Our forefathers would already be shooting"

Think about it.

The truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth!
3 years 44 weeks ago, 8:35 AM

Saint J.M. Browning

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100% true

Vaquero wrote:
"Our forefathers would already be shooting"
Think about it.

I believe this. I think we haven't lost enough to make us want to risk what we have. Not a good excuse, but there it is.

"I don't think Hank done it this way" - Waylon
3 years 44 weeks ago, 8:45 PM

LLE

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READ the Vienna Convention document language. [sometimes called the treaty for all treaties]. If the USA signer does not comply with the terms of the Vienna Convention treaty, her signiture will be a violation of that treaty. It is known, internationally, that the US Senate MUST ratify, before the terms of a new treaty can be implemented. If she signs, without proof of the Senate ratification, she is, in fact, commiting perjury on behalf of herself AND the USA, and she will have violated federal regulations.

Too old to fight, Too old to run, guess that's why I carry a gun! "would someone show this asshole the way out of town".[Rabbi Avram Belinski-aka "The Frisco Kid"]
3 years 44 weeks ago, 9:27 PM

luckybychoice

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Well i hope so LLE

that dick morris is flat wrong.

from the state department website

Vienna Convention on the Law of Treaties

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Is the United States a party to the Vienna Convention on the Law of Treaties?

No. The United States signed the treaty on April 24, 1970. The U.S. Senate has not given its advice and consent to the treaty. The United States considers many of the provisions of the Vienna Convention on the Law of Treaties to constitute customary international law on the law of treaties.

i tried being reasonable,i didn't like it, NRA LIFE MEMBER,USMC VETERAN
3 years 44 weeks ago, 10:53 PM

LLE

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I obviously neglected to recognize that fact. Thus, technically, the question of a Clinton signiture begs the question of whether the USA's assent should even be sought after. Acceptance of a USA assent [under those conditions], would represent a violation of the Vienna Convention. And, the participating U S Exective Branch officials complicit in the process, probably could be cited for violation of federal law.

Too old to fight, Too old to run, guess that's why I carry a gun! "would someone show this asshole the way out of town".[Rabbi Avram Belinski-aka "The Frisco Kid"]
3 years 44 weeks ago, 10:08 AM

MattyTheJet

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Federal Law Violations

They'll just pardon themselves.

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