Forums / Political & Legal / New California Ammo Regs - Effective Feb. 2011

4 years 12 weeks ago, 5:31 PM

dynadog44

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In California on October 11 2009, Gov. Schwarzenegger signed Assembly Bill 962 into law. For those of you who do not know, a portion of this law becomes effective February 1, 2011 which requires anybody purchasing handgun ammunition in California to register with the state. Those of us in California will have to provide our name, address, date of birth, and right thumbprint to the seller in order to lawfully purchase ammo. Because of this registration process, all transactions must be conducted in person, so mail order sales will be banned.

Initially, there may be some benefit to shooter's in other States. According to the National Shooting Sports Foundation (NSSF), California consumers purchase about 12% of the ammo purchased in the US Market annually (approximately 1.2 billion rounds of ammo). Because many companies who ship ammo to purchasers in CA will discontinue services, this may create lower supplies within CA, effectively increasing prices within our state. This may also cause an increase in supply to the rest of the US which may temporarily decrease prices to the rest of the US.

There is a prospective drawback for the rest of the gun enthusiasts. I urge you all to keep an eye on your local legislature because California is often considered a testing ground for state laws. If a law passes in a State, a law gains a certain amount of validity by its very existence. Law professionals refer to this as "precedence, established doctrine and legal doctrine.” Whether the law is effective or not, if a law becomes established doctrine in one state, a law becomes a credible reference point for those seeking to enact the law in another state.

The NRA has not been effective in preventing this or other similar gun laws here in California, so I recommend that you do not just sit back and pay your NRA dues. Please keep an eye on your local legislators to protect your rights.

4 years 12 weeks ago, 10:41 PM

BluedSteelCharisma

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JESUS

Whats the world coming too....fingerprints for ammo....psssh

The evils of tyranny are rarely seen, but by he who resists it.
4 years 12 weeks ago, 6:02 PM

hangman

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Crazy stuff

The loss of personal freedoms is one of the reasons we moved out of CA. After living there for 35 years we moved back to the state where I was born, NC. We had all better fight for our freedoms and rights or they will all be lost, one-by-one. We should all pay attention.

4 years 12 weeks ago, 11:30 PM

dynadog44

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Fingerprints

I hear ya BSC! I can't believe I will be giving that up every time I purchase ammo :S

4 years 12 weeks ago, 1:14 AM

RyantheGUNLover

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That is ridiculous.

That is ridiculous.

Ryan Riola
4 years 12 weeks ago, 1:25 AM

dynadog44

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My sentiments exactly.

My sentiments exactly.

4 years 12 weeks ago, 1:54 AM

CharlesW

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There is the source of your problem.
What would the Gov of Cali do if approached
by a coyote while out jogging? Try to climb a tree ?
Gov of Texas popped a cap on one with a
357 he carried.

A little rebellion is good medicine for the government Thomas Jefferson
4 years 12 weeks ago, 2:14 AM

dynadog44

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I agree

That is an awesome point. The good news is that there is a hearing scheduled for January 18th which ma declare parts of this bill unconstitutional. I'll do a little more research and see if I can get an update in here.

4 years 12 weeks ago, 9:34 AM

mattitude

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Let's hope that parts of the law, if not the whole thing, are struck down.

Is it really that you have to provide that info every time, including fingerprint? Or is it a one time registration with fingerprint, and every subsequent purchase they verify your identity.

Either way it is disturbing and makes me glad that I live in a state that is very Pro 2nd Amendment (for now).

"...one is allowed to resist against the unjust aggressor to one's life [...] even 'til the aggressor’s death. In fact, this act is aimed at preserving one’s life and to make the aggressor powerless. Thus, it is a good act" - Thomas Aquinas
4 years 12 weeks ago, 2:16 PM

dynadog44

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Fingerprints

As it stands right now... Name, State ID and Fingerprint every single time. It could potentially be a real bitch. We have lawyers representing the NRA and CRPA that are working on an injunction to shut it down during a hearing on January 18th. I will need to research more to learn more about it. I certainly have my fingers crossed.

4 years 12 weeks ago, 5:44 PM

zx12rmike

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Mr DynaDog44, First Welcome to gunslot I hope you like it here. I am certainly pissed about that BACKSTABBER Mr. Schwartzenasshole. A petition needs to be organized to overturn this bullshit. I wish I knew what to do.

"We cannot defend freedom abroad by deserting it at home" Thomas Jefferson
4 years 12 weeks ago, 6:21 PM

dynadog44

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Warm Welcome

Thanks for the warm welcome ZX! I do like it in here and this is a cool culture you all have fostered. I've read many of your posts and I'm looking forward to touching base on future discussions with you. As for the aforementioned CA Regs, I'm hoping we can knock this down before it takes effect in February. Thanks for the words of support! CA shooters appreciate it.

4 years 12 weeks ago, 5:58 PM

Bigshot Nobody

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Just like getting a

driver's license in Georgia. Fingerprint yourself like some common criminal to get your driver's license there. I quit paying dues to NRA a long time ago. Pay Gun Owners now and tithe to a couple others. Argue that the fingerprinting violates Title 5 Section 552(I think ....privacy clauses). Fingerprints are Private property and cannot(shouldn't) be forced provided.

Other note,,,, I don't think I had a chance to Gunslot Welcome Blued and Dynadog myself aye. Mattitude, goes for you too if I missed you. (I get in and out around here lately). Peace to Your Good Houses and hope you have a good New Year aye.

"We fight not for Glory nor for Honors; but only and alone we fight for Freedom, which no Good Man surrenders but with his life" - Robert the Bruce "Declaration of Arbroath"
4 years 12 weeks ago, 6:30 PM

dynadog44

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Thanks Bigshot

It's great to meet you! I was pretty disappointed in this Reg myself. I'm hoping the NRA and CRPA can step it up on this to prevent this from taking place. Have a safe and happy new year!

4 years 12 weeks ago, 6:02 PM

ACE

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Welcome Guys!!

And HELLO Mike and Big N!!! How have ya'll been??

“When firearms go, all goes. We need them every hour.”- George Washington
4 years 12 weeks ago, 6:03 PM

zx12rmike

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ACE, is in Da house! How are you? Long time!!

"We cannot defend freedom abroad by deserting it at home" Thomas Jefferson
4 years 12 weeks ago, 6:05 PM

ACE

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Im still kicking... And it has been a long time!! Hope all has been well w U!!

“When firearms go, all goes. We need them every hour.”- George Washington
4 years 12 weeks ago, 6:06 PM

Vaquero

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Howdy guys! and Gal!

How goes it? I been busy and have a lousy connection, among other things.

The truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth!
4 years 12 weeks ago, 6:07 PM

ACE

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Hey Vaq!!

Hope U had a happy HOHO!!!

“When firearms go, all goes. We need them every hour.”- George Washington
4 years 12 weeks ago, 6:11 PM

Vaquero

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The HO didn't show!

Just kidding, it was great. How about you?

The truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth!
4 years 12 weeks ago, 6:13 PM

ACE

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It was just another day 4 me. Sucks!! But it'll get better. (It better)

“When firearms go, all goes. We need them every hour.”- George Washington
4 years 12 weeks ago, 7:35 AM

HappinessIsaWarmGun

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Only in Texas

The firearms manufacture that makes the Ruger handgun is capitalizing on the recent news reports that Texas Governor Rick Perry shot and killed a coyote with a Ruger .380 while on an early morning jog with his daughter’s Lab.  Ruger has released a special Ruger .380 commemorating this occasion.

On the box it comes in it says “For Sale to Texans Only.”  It says “Coyote Special” on one side of the barrel and “A True Texan” on the other side of the barrel.  The top of the barrel has a Texas star and a Coyote howling to a full moon.

No problem getting guns or ammo here!

4 years 12 weeks ago, 7:33 PM

Reaper308

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kali

it doesn't say anything about one box per month here

"Proelium Comminus Auctoritate" "Sometimes the light at the end of the tunnel is a muzzle flash."
4 years 12 weeks ago, 8:36 PM

mattitude

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I think the statement that you would be limited to Purchasing one box per month is incorrect. Reading the summary of the law from the California Senate, you would not be able to sell or "transfer" more than 50 rounds per month unless registered as an ammunition vendor.

http://info.sen.ca.gov/pub/09-10/bill/asm/ab_0951-1000/ab_962_bill_20090...

So you can't sell or gift or transfer more than 50 rounds per month, but there are no limitations on the amount that you can buy per month.

"...one is allowed to resist against the unjust aggressor to one's life [...] even 'til the aggressor’s death. In fact, this act is aimed at preserving one’s life and to make the aggressor powerless. Thus, it is a good act" - Thomas Aquinas
4 years 12 weeks ago, 9:34 PM

dynadog44

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*Whew*

Big sigh of relief in San Jose. I was starting to get worked up.

4 years 12 weeks ago, 9:37 PM

BluedSteelCharisma

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how to help

so what is there to do to combat these ridiculous laws...besides joining the nra and writing your congress man

The evils of tyranny are rarely seen, but by he who resists it.
4 years 9 weeks ago, 1:02 PM

Shug22

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Help

BluedSteel, as one vet who fought for this country, I gotta say that I am pissed off from the top of my head all the way down past my ass about what has happened to our country. I am hoping that most of us red, white and blue patriots have drawn a line in the sand and said this is enough. And I hope that the leaders in Washington start repealing and replacing all of these stupid laws real quick or we will have to fire this crew also. I fear that if this doesn't happen soon, we will be forced to defend our families and our country from inside it's borders. God Bless us all including the folks who got us here.

4 years 9 weeks ago, 2:46 PM

BluedSteelCharisma

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but i feel an unconventional approach is going to be more applicable, don't get me wrong if it was as clear cut as the first revolution i would be the first to load a musket and head for the line in the sand. But like i said before they wont fight fair, why would they, i wouldn't. i feel the majority are oblivious anyway, figuring 85% to 90%, and lets say out of that 10% percent they are all already on a "terrorist" watch list and going to be the first ones taken out. not that we all aren't limited in what we can realistically do anyway. at one day in age i could jump on a horse and ride from california to north carolina, drink from the streams, hunt the land, and live. if something broke out now the fuel limits the travel and keeps us divided, the water is all polluted, the land is raped and separated good luck finding game with every other hungry person with a gun in the small patch of forest looking for it, then after that factor in the 85% 90% who had no idea and will kill you on sight for your things. were doomed as a country there will be no revolution, its going downhill from here. and it will be an act of survival not a war. theres to much to tell but i feel there is a reason we are kept so poor as a whole, i would rather have a one room cabin and a full refrigerator and a basement full of ammo, water, and food than a big "nice" house full of junk. from the time ive spent in some 3rd world countries i can tell you were not far off as a whole, we are just starving in style, thats the way i put it. i laugh to myself when i step back and look a the people in this country now a days compared to what I've seen in some others. sickening almost

The evils of tyranny are rarely seen, but by he who resists it.
4 years 9 weeks ago, 6:01 PM

FreedomBringer

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My friend is on a "Terrorist" watch list for watching a fight at a high school. Your right, things are going downhill fast and we just need to be prepared for the worst. There might not be a revolution,.. now that you have me thinking about it... americans are so stupid! I can't understand why people are fine with going to and from their jobs day after day, thinking where to go for lunch or what's the gossip for the day. While others are starving in the streets, homeless. People are desensitized from the lies on TV. The lies from our own government, and while we are being brainwashed, the men behind the curtain (Rockefellers or Rothchilds) have a huge plan to bring us down! If you know a freemason, ask them what their plan for the U.S is. Lets band together. I need to get out of caifornia, that's for damn sure! On the other hand we need to remember that God is in controll, he created us and he can smash us into dust. There will always be this battle of good vs. evil as long as we don't go by God's commandments. Humans were given the gift of free will. We will either do good or evil. We can turn from evil and know that Jesus is God's son sent here to die on the cross for OUR sins, and whoever believes in Him shall have everlasting life. Then we could live in peace and not think about these liers in office. haha

4 years 12 weeks ago, 11:03 PM

Doomguard

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that suggested laser inscribing serial #'s on bullets so they could be tracked easier. I don't envy those of you who live there. You could always move :). Perhaps you could bring suit for unreasonable search and seizure against the state government as part of the challenge of the law on the basis that it violates your constitutional rights. I really don't like seeing any state pass laws of this nature, it unfortunately sets a legal precedent that other gun grabbing governments can use to avoid suits of the nature above in the future.
Another way to protect these rights in your state is to do something like this:

North Dakota State Constitution:
Article 1, Section 1
All individuals are by nature equally free and independent and have certain
inalienable rights, among which are those of enjoying and defending life and liberty; acquiring,
possessing and protecting property and reputation; pursuing and obtaining safety and happiness;
and to keep and bear arms for the defense of their person, family, property, and the state, and for
lawful hunting, recreational, and other lawful purposes, which shall not be infringed.

Article 1, Section 20:
To guard against transgressions of the high powers which we have
delegated, we declare that everything in this article is excepted out of the general powers of
government and shall forever remain inviolate.

Not only did they enshrine gun ownership in article 1, section 1, but they've also stated that this article is unalterable.

Every citizen should be a soldier. This was the case with the Greeks and Romans, and must be that of every free state. -Thomas Jefferson
4 years 12 weeks ago, 5:10 PM

dynadog44

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Hey Guns Lot Users,
Here is a link which will give you an update on the legal battle to stop AB 962 from taking effect. This update is posted on a site which is maintained by the legal team hired by the California Board of the NRA as well as the CRPA (California Rifle and Pistol Association). I say this to disclose the fact that you may feel that any opinions expressed are a little biased. I feel that it is written in an impartial manner and it is a credible update on what has happened as well as what they intend to do at the hearing on January 18, 2011. Instead of attempting to paraphrase it, I'm just going to give you the link so you can read it and decide for yourself.

http://www.calgunlaws.com/index.php/current-litigation/82-cases-litigati...

4 years 12 weeks ago, 9:26 PM

mattitude

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I think the second lawsuit, OOIDA v. Lindley, has a better chance of succeeding, because the federal gov preempts states when it comes to interstate commerce. That being said, states have been allowed to regulate interstate commerce over certain things such as alcohol.

The first lawsuit seems weak, unfortunately. They say its main argument is that the law is "incomprehensible". I personally don't find that a very compelling argument. I do think that the law's definition of "handgun ammunition" is vague, but usually the laws leave further definition of terms like that up to the agency given responsibility for enforcing the law.

I am going to stay positive about the outcome, and i am NOT an constitutional lawyer, but I don't think either lawsuit is a sure thing.

"...one is allowed to resist against the unjust aggressor to one's life [...] even 'til the aggressor’s death. In fact, this act is aimed at preserving one’s life and to make the aggressor powerless. Thus, it is a good act" - Thomas Aquinas
4 years 10 weeks ago, 3:26 AM

FreedomBringer

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NO NEW WORLD ORDER

This whole fingerprint thing is one more step closer to us losing our freedoms. The government is leaking the U.S dry of everything. Pretty soon our guns will be taken from us. They are controlling our weather with the chemtrails all over the world. We are being brainwashed by our boxes in the living room. The dollar is worth .2 cents. The illuminati is going to beat us if we dont hurry up, come together, and FIGHT BACK! Gold and Silver is going up in worth. Buy gold and silver now while you still can. prepare your family. Buy canned food, build an underground bunker or PRAY that the Lord comes soon. Learn as if your going to live forever. Live as if your going to die tomorrow. Do your research on HAARP, Chemtrails, 911 world trade center had explosives placed in the buildings including WTC7 Building 7, New World Order, U.S Concentration Camps, stacks of black coffins for us guys! Do your reasearch and we must fight back! Look up the Colorado Airport Murals. What is that about?? Stomp the weak and cradel the dead i guess... God help us.

4 years 11 weeks ago, 5:33 AM

ahammers

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This is why more people should write to congress!

4 years 10 weeks ago, 11:05 PM

Ishootdaily

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Well shit!

I guess a Can will cost you a left nut for DNA purposes...

No sir, he fell into that bullet... Never argue with a stupid person. They'll just drag you down to their level and beat you with experience!!
4 years 10 weeks ago, 10:46 AM

runawaygun762

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Well thought out and thought-provoking commentary on American concentration camps and black (As opposed to red. That'd be some communist shit right there) coffins. I am now appropriately scared.

"I have always been a soldier. I have known no other life. The calling of arms, I have followed from boyhood. I have never sought another." From The Virtues of War, by Steven Pressfield.
4 years 9 weeks ago, 9:46 AM

Ishootdaily

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"Fresno Superior Court ruled this week that California's new ammunition regulation law is unconstitutional, and blocked further enforcement. The law -- enacted last year as AB 962 -- banned mail order ammunition sales and required all purchases of so called "handgun ammunition" to be registered. In an unwritten ruling from the bench, Judge Jeffrey Hamilton found the law unconstitutionally vague on its face and issued an injunction against its enforcement. For now, at least, mail order ammunition sales to California residents can continue, and ammunition sales need not be registered under the law."

Cool beans.

No sir, he fell into that bullet... Never argue with a stupid person. They'll just drag you down to their level and beat you with experience!!
4 years 9 weeks ago, 12:50 PM

BluedSteelCharisma

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haha

i woke up to an email on my blackberry from the NRA this morning, and in a sleepy haze i was like....well done california....touche. then instantly went to sleep

The evils of tyranny are rarely seen, but by he who resists it.
4 years 9 weeks ago, 12:55 PM

Ishootdaily

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hehe

I was still awake when it came in.. Puts some thoughts to rest on what the hell those people are thinking out there...

No sir, he fell into that bullet... Never argue with a stupid person. They'll just drag you down to their level and beat you with experience!!
4 years 9 weeks ago, 6:55 PM

Shug22

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Blued Steel, I hope it hasn't gotten so far that we are talking about a hidden cabin stocked with necessities for individual families. But you could be very right. Hope and pray that change comes so we can all survive. Most are not even thinking along these lines.

4 years 9 weeks ago, 6:34 PM

CharlesW

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Live in the wilderness, Republic of Texas, United States

I have a storm cellar in my back yard.
Underground concrete bunker lol

My farm is miles from nowhere, just the
way I like it.

A little rebellion is good medicine for the government Thomas Jefferson
4 years 9 weeks ago, 6:54 PM

Shug22

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storm cellar

Hey CW, my granddaddy was a west texas ranch hand as a young man and I remember him telling about living in those houses that were half underground and half above; don't remember what they are called. Palo Dura canyon has some. And the tornado shelters ya'll need out there work perfect right? Best thing for you is living miles from nowhere! Stay safe my friend.

4 years 9 weeks ago, 7:52 PM

Ishootdaily

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Wifes Uncles house

is dug out of a hill side outside Blair Nebraska. Front of the house is normal enough though, his Dog barn is also built the same way. He breeds, trains and sells Spaniels for bird hunting. Damn barn smells like hell but when you go in with the dogs it doesn't seem to matter.

No sir, he fell into that bullet... Never argue with a stupid person. They'll just drag you down to their level and beat you with experience!!
4 years 9 weeks ago, 8:03 PM

Shug22

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Dug outs

ISD, I bet that house and dog house is pretty cool. Also bet you won't find a hill to dig into near Tampa Bay? Probably get water in a foot.

4 years 9 weeks ago, 11:29 AM

Ishootdaily

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on a Pool!

I remember once as a kid in winter, a cold wave hit that dropped so fast and so low in temp that much of the fish died in the lake we lived on. My damn Shepard ran around the little cove we lived on and brought all the dead fresh water Mullet into our back yard. Dick made me dig a hole and put the fish in it and cover them up. Now that was one nasty, wet, muddy, stinking hole. I've had an aversion of digging and my hands refuse to grip a Shovel handle to this day!

No sir, he fell into that bullet... Never argue with a stupid person. They'll just drag you down to their level and beat you with experience!!
4 years 9 weeks ago, 9:39 AM

luckybychoice

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well

at least they finally got it right,i think they should concentrate on how fucked their schools are first,quit with the BS stuff like ammo sales,fucking hippies.

i tried being reasonable,i didn't like it, NRA LIFE MEMBER,USMC VETERAN
4 years 9 weeks ago, 5:22 PM

FreedomBringer

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Our system is already fucked. It's "the cool thing to get pregnant at 16". Our leaders are so corrupt they only care about their own lives and their power. They are trying to bleed us dry of everything this country has and give the power to europe. So yea, we care about ammo sales, we dont want a new world order and we want to keep our rights to bear arms for the protection our families and keep the constitution intact! We have to talk about it so the people are aware and so we can do something about it before we lose our freedoms. How bad will it be when we are no longer able to buy ammo because some people think guns kill people? Bill Maher was just debating this topic! GUNS DONT KILL PEOPLE, PEOPLE KILL PEOPLE BILL! WAKE UP!!!

4 years 9 weeks ago, 11:24 AM

Ishootdaily

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LOL

What can you expect from a bunch of people who actually consider EBONICS a Language....

LOL

No sir, he fell into that bullet... Never argue with a stupid person. They'll just drag you down to their level and beat you with experience!!
4 years 9 weeks ago, 6:33 PM

Shug22

Shug22's picture

Rank:
Brigadier General
Points:
215
Join Date:
Jul 2010
Location:
Texas, United States

Freedom Bringer: Well..... amen.

4 years 9 weeks ago, 8:14 PM

Ishootdaily

Ishootdaily's picture

Rank:
General
Points:
4375
Join Date:
Feb 2009
Location:
Saint Petersburg, Florida, United States
post order...

Kinda wild how it reads, my post following up Luckys was before Free's but it kinda still applys in some odd way.

LOL

No sir, he fell into that bullet... Never argue with a stupid person. They'll just drag you down to their level and beat you with experience!!

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