This LittleDragon's candidate for the worst assault rifle in the world today. The Indian make INSAS.

This LittleDragon's candidate for the worst assault rifle in the world today. The Indian make INSAS.

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5 years 40 weeks ago, 11:52 AM

Mosinfreak

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insas

looks like an AK with crappy furniture and a bren smg carry handle...whoopee

"Guard against the impostures of pretended patriotism" -George Washington, Farewell Address, September 19, 1796
5 years 40 weeks ago, 11:54 AM

LittleDragon

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From what have read about this weapon, if you want to call it a weapon, is that the polymer magazine and "furniture" of this rifle cracks and splits in cold weather. It jams constantly in hot weather. In any weather it can get stuck in full automatic mode when set to 3 round burst. It not very accurate and it not shoot very far. It also not have chamber capable of handling the M262 OTM +P round.

Would like to hear other opinion on what is your candidate for the worst assault rifle make in world today. Btw, INSAS stand for Indian National Small Arms System.

Your friend,

LittleDragon

Here are the stats from Wikipedia. Please remember that Wiki is often not very accurate about stats and in this case ryo think Wiki give this rifle too much benefit of doubt neh.

Insas Assault Rifle (Fixed butt)
Type Assault rifle
Place of origin India
Service history
In service 1997—present
Used by See Users
Wars Kargil War
Nepalese Civil War
Production history
Designer ARDE
Manufacturer Indian State Ordnance Factory Board, Ishapore
Variants See Variants
Specifications
Weight 4.25 kg (9.4 lb) empty
4.6 kg (10.1 lb) loaded
Length 960 mm (37.8 in),
750 mm (29.5 in) w/stock folded
Barrel length 464 mm (18.3 in)
Cartridge 5.56x45mm NATO
Action Gas-operated, Rotating bolt
Rate of fire 650 rounds/min
Muzzle velocity 900 m/s (2,953 ft/s)
Effective range 450 m
Feed system 20/30-round detachable box magazine

Moshi Moshi from LittleDragon
5 years 40 weeks ago, 12:04 PM

LittleDragon

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Check out the INSAS and see if this is something you could stomach even as target to shoot at rather than to shoot. lol!

Your friend alway,

LittleDragon

Moshi Moshi from LittleDragon
5 years 40 weeks ago, 12:29 PM

ivantank

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INSAS....TOY GUN

LittleDragon wrote:
Check out the INSAS and see if this is something you could stomach even as target to shoot at rather than to shoot. lol!

Your friend alway,

LittleDragon
EVEN THE COLOR IS BABY PUKE...

I have reasons for the things I do, just don't expect them to be reasonable
5 years 40 weeks ago, 1:32 PM

LittleDragon

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it not fair to any toy gun to compare it to this uhm "rifle" if you want to call it that. lol!

Your friend alway,

LittleDragon

Moshi Moshi from LittleDragon
5 years 40 weeks ago, 12:53 PM

raffycanlas

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the insas

oh god, tell me it doesnt have a plastic stock made to look like wood lol.

I'm just another damn yankee with a loaded gun looking for some fun!
5 years 40 weeks ago, 1:29 PM

LittleDragon

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yup sure look like it neh

btw what would be raffy chan candidate for worst assault rifle make today ka

your friend alway,

LittleDragon

Moshi Moshi from LittleDragon
5 years 40 weeks ago, 3:10 PM

Reaper308

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British SA80

I don't have first hand experience.... but I would nominate the SA80 (L85) family for their brutal looks (sorry ryo, I know you like bullpups) and their notorious reputation for jamming/malfunctions. The Venezuela special forces purchased some of these rifles to replace their FALs in the 90's and discontinued using them shortly after.

although the INSAS sounds like it would be a headache as well

"Proelium Comminus Auctoritate" "Sometimes the light at the end of the tunnel is a muzzle flash."
5 years 40 weeks ago, 3:33 PM

LittleDragon

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Reaper chan

have heard and read many thing about Brit SA80 both good and bad. think verdict is still out. btw they not have this weapon in Falkland War, at least ryo not think so. please correct if ryo is wrong about this. however from what have read and from what my ojiisan (grandpa) and my pops tell me, it not bad rifle, it just not good rifle. could you please explain more about what you know about the SA80 ka ryo want to learn.

your friend and student alway,

LittleDragon

Moshi Moshi from LittleDragon
5 years 40 weeks ago, 5:30 PM

fordvg

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Falkland War

The Britsh were using the FN FAL rifle in the Falkland inland war. The British FN FAL was only in semi and not in full auto.

"WAR IS A RACKET, I spent most of my time being a high-class muscle-man for Big Business, for Wall Street, and for the Bankers." Major-General Smedley Darlington Butler USMC Ret. 2 time Medal of Honor winner.
5 years 40 weeks ago, 5:45 PM

LittleDragon

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Victor chan arigato!

were not the argentinians also using same rifle in this war ka seem to remember from somewhere that this was first war where both side use same rifle, but am not very sure of this. FN FAL is very excellent rifle. my pops say it still one of most popular special forces rifle even still in world today. ryo reading on this confirm what my pops say. over 1 million have been sold and FN Herstal have over 2 million new order for this rifle on their books. it actual very amazing thing neh. the FN FAL was the basis for the FN FNC which in turn lead directly to the very best AK style rifle ever make, the Swedish make AK 5 Basic. even though it kind of hard to refer to the AK 5 Basic as an AK at all. It more like AR than many AR type rifle neh.

Your friend alway and forever,

LittleDragon

Moshi Moshi from LittleDragon
5 years 40 weeks ago, 5:58 PM

fordvg

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Yes, Ryo kun

Yes, the Argentinians were using the same rifle in this war. The only diff is the Argentinians FN FAL rifle had a full auto set of fire and the British did not. I have shot the FN FAL in both semi and full auto. In the full auto it is a hand full. Very good rifle in semi fire and very accurate too.

"WAR IS A RACKET, I spent most of my time being a high-class muscle-man for Big Business, for Wall Street, and for the Bankers." Major-General Smedley Darlington Butler USMC Ret. 2 time Medal of Honor winner.
5 years 40 weeks ago, 5:23 PM

LittleDragon

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ryo not argue with you on looks. SA80 have to rank as one of ugliest bullpup rifle ryo ever see. it just go to show that venezuela is run by nut case. FN FAL is actual very fine rifle neh. could not understand why they would want to replace it with SA80, cause it make no sense neh.

Your friend and student alway,

LittleDragon

Moshi Moshi from LittleDragon
5 years 40 weeks ago, 5:36 PM

Reaper308

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LD

HK upgraded the rifles in 2000. The L85A1's were the rifles with all of the problems. All of the L85A2's have been modified by HK and are said to be much more reliable.

This came from wikipedia......

Service and modification
The SA80 gained an initial poor reputation amongst British Soldiers and Royal Marines as being unreliable and fragile, a fact picked up by the UK media,[5] and entertainment industry.[7] The writer and former soldier Andy McNab said in his book Bravo Two Zero, that the British Army procured a "Rolls-Royce in the SA80, albeit a prototype Rolls-Royce".

Some of the rifle's problems were corrected though earlier modifications (e.g. the magazine release guard and trigger) but complaints over reliability in service continued. As a result, a more extensive modification programme was enacted. In 2000, Heckler & Koch, at that time owned by Royal Ordnance, was contracted to upgrade the SA80 family of weapons. Two hundred thousand SA80s were re-manufactured at a cost of £400 each, producing the A2 variant. Changes focused primarily on improving reliability and include: a redesigned cocking handle, modified bolt, extractor and a redesigned hammer assembly that produces a slight delay in the hammer's operation in continuous fire mode, improving reliability and stability. There were equivalent LSW and Carbine modifications.[5] The British Ministry of Defence describes the L85A2 revision as "modified in light of operational experience... the most reliable weapons of their type in the world".[8] Army trials had indicated extremely good reliability over a range of climates for various operational scenarios, though with a decline in reliability in hot, and especially hot and dry conditions.[9].

The modified A2 variants are distinguished by the 'HK A2' marking on the top of the weapon just forward of the buttplate, and the distinctive comma shaped cocking handle. A higher quality HK steel STANAG 4179 magazine is now used.

Deployment
The SA80 has been used in all conflicts in which the British Army has been involved with since its introduction in the mid-80s. Deployments include Northern Ireland, the First Gulf War, Bosnia, Kosovo, Sierra Leone, the Second Gulf War and Afghanistan.

In the mid-90s Venezuela purchased a small batch of these weapons for use by their Special Forces, with the possibility of replacing the aging, but still capable, FN FALs of the entire Venezuelan Armed Forces with the SA80. General discontent with the design and alleged reliability problems, particularly in jungle settings, quickly led to the dismissal of this weapon from all active service within Venezuela.[5]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SA80

"Proelium Comminus Auctoritate" "Sometimes the light at the end of the tunnel is a muzzle flash."
5 years 40 weeks ago, 6:25 PM

LittleDragon

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Reaper chan

thank you so much for this. it excellent information and ryo appreciate much!

Your friend alway,

LittleDragon

Moshi Moshi from LittleDragon
5 years 40 weeks ago, 3:13 PM

samD

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Hope all is well. Oxycontine is wonderful for pain... Just don't make a habit of it. I was on it for 2 weeks while trying to pass a kidney stone, the size of Rhode island.

5 years 40 weeks ago, 3:17 PM

Reaper308

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AHHHHHH

bad mental image! yes, the pk's are nice. Dont have any oxycontin... but do have plenty of percocet and vicodine. still hurting a bit, but have had much worse.

"Proelium Comminus Auctoritate" "Sometimes the light at the end of the tunnel is a muzzle flash."
5 years 40 weeks ago, 3:20 PM

samD

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If ya fell off you were going way to friggin fast, and if you didn't fall off you weren't going fast enough!

5 years 40 weeks ago, 3:29 PM

LittleDragon

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regular muscle relaxer not work well on ryo and often just put to sleep so doctor give codeine for spasm and to help control shakiness but also have new drug, ryo not pretend to be able to spell correctly, for trembling in hand and finger. it this new drug that allow ryo to be able to shoot. ryo is very grateful to doctor and to my pops for helping ryo to be able to be real shooter now.

Your friend alway,

LittleDragon

Moshi Moshi from LittleDragon
5 years 40 weeks ago, 3:36 PM

raffycanlas

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hey ryo

try beer, lol, it works for me.

I'm just another damn yankee with a loaded gun looking for some fun!
5 years 40 weeks ago, 3:38 PM

raffycanlas

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to be honest, i cant answer that, i dont know a lot about assault rifles, all i know is, ive fired an ak47 when i was 15 and i am planning on buying one, on the atlantic arms website, they are selling an ak47 set that includes the rifle, bayonet, strap, bag, and 2 mags for about 550 dollars.

I'm just another damn yankee with a loaded gun looking for some fun!
5 years 40 weeks ago, 3:45 PM

LittleDragon

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even at price offer, ryo would not buy AK 47. it just blunderbuss that spray lot lead. you could not hit the ground with one in 3 try neh. it notorius for bad accuracy. but if need spray lot lead and put up wall of fire it ok but suggest you save money until can afford decent brand AR. just some friendly thought.

Your friend alway,

LittleDragon

Moshi Moshi from LittleDragon
5 years 40 weeks ago, 4:00 PM

Nitris

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LittleDragon wrote:
even at price offer, ryo would not buy AK 47. it just blunderbuss that spray lot lead. you could not hit the ground with one in 3 try neh. it notorius for bad accuracy. but if need spray lot lead and put up wall of fire it ok but suggest you save money until can afford decent brand AR. just some friendly thought.

Your friend alway,

LittleDragon

Will have to buck you on this one buddy, I have chinese and Yugo ak-47's at 100 yards 1 inch group. But will agree AR's are the better accuracy. Love my AR's and AK's

Ron Paul 2012 III
5 years 40 weeks ago, 4:15 PM

LittleDragon

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even so, you not being fair. Yugo version of AK 47 correct some problem with russian version of same weapon to correct, walking up, problem of high power full automatic AK 47. however, please look at longer reply that ryo make to raffy san. ryo still think that for accuracy and long range it tough for any AK to beat an AR. just friendly thought.

Your friend alway,

LittleDragon

Moshi Moshi from LittleDragon
5 years 40 weeks ago, 4:33 PM

Nitris

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Agree little dragon

LittleDragon wrote:
even so, you not being fair. Yugo version of AK 47 correct some problem with russian version of same weapon to correct, walking up, problem of high power full automatic AK 47. however, please look at longer reply that ryo make to raffy san. ryo still think that for accuracy and long range it tough for any AK to beat an AR. just friendly thought.

Your friend alway,

LittleDragon

Was just debucking your spray and pray, true AK's are not as accurate as an AR and if that's what you need by all means buy a AR but for the fun.............AK any day.

Ron Paul 2012 III
5 years 40 weeks ago, 4:34 PM

Nitris

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agree little dragon

Nitris wrote:
LittleDragon wrote:
even so, you not being fair. Yugo version of AK 47 correct some problem with russian version of same weapon to correct, walking up, problem of high power full automatic AK 47. however, please look at longer reply that ryo make to raffy san. ryo still think that for accuracy and long range it tough for any AK to beat an AR. just friendly thought.

Your friend alway,

LittleDragon

Was just debunking your spray and pray, true AK's are not as accurate as an AR and if that's what you need by all means buy a AR but for the fun.............AK any day.

Ron Paul 2012 III
5 years 40 weeks ago, 5:34 PM

LittleDragon

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but ryo alway respect your opinion. you are one of most knowledgeable gun meisters on this site. ryo have HUGE respect for your wisdom and understanding. but ryo will stick to gun as saying go and maintain that there are better weapon to purchase than AK 47 even if want to spray lead wall out. even other AK type weaponry are better than the 47, but this is ryo opinion. ryo not claim as fact. ryo is your friend and enjoy learning from you sir.

Your friend alway,

LittleDragon

Moshi Moshi from LittleDragon
5 years 40 weeks ago, 3:41 PM

samD

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Raffy

I have seen a pic of you on beer, you are scary. You drinking that San Miguel's again?

5 years 40 weeks ago, 3:45 PM

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i wish i was, i havent tried the san miguel dark lager yet but many people who have tried it say its one of the best, when you saw my pic it was me after a few coors lights, its my favorite beer now, i used to like bud.

I'm just another damn yankee with a loaded gun looking for some fun!
5 years 40 weeks ago, 3:45 PM

charley9toe

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F-INSAS has been started and should correct the matriculation of various designs efforts made with the current squad level firearms. How long will it take? well it's all a part of an better integrated tactical unit force which also requires communications and vehicle upgrades. They are also rewriting their tactical maneuver concepts. I think thats the info I've gained from a very short read on the net.

(You have to look behind all of that outer space stuff)
5 years 40 weeks ago, 3:51 PM

raffycanlas

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ryo

true that, the ak47 that ive fired is so dead on accurate, but then again, it was only accurate cuz the target was not as far, probably just 50 yards if not even less, but cmon buddy, blunderbuss effect isnt that bad hehehe. i wish i had a real blunderbuss.

I'm just another damn yankee with a loaded gun looking for some fun!
5 years 40 weeks ago, 4:08 PM

LittleDragon

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It certain kind of concept neh. original idea was for this weapon to be extremely reliable under any and all circumstance and for this ryo will give it credit because this is true. it one of most reliable to shoot weapon ever make. you can soak it in salt water or mud and then it will still fire. it not matter weather condition or anything, dust, heat, cold, sand storm, the AK 47 will still fire. but you about right though. 50 meter is about limit of reliable accuracy of this weapon. Remember it chamber for very powerful russian 7.62mm x 39mm .308R round. it spray lead like none other. but it true what ryo say too. it just blunderbuss. it not best weapon for you to spend money on at all. you should save money and either buy better type AK weapon such as FN FAL or FN FNC or AK 5 Basic, but even so still think you better off with AR. AK 47 original concept base on General Vasily Chuikov concept of hugging combat. get in close. very close. closer than 50 meter so enemy cannot use long range weaponry against you. AK 47 perfect for Chuikov concept even though rifle come after second world war and of course after General Chuikov's brilliant defense of city of Stalingrad against overwhelming odds. ryo strongly recommend you spend money on better weapon. just some thought. if of course up to you to decide.

Your friend alway,

LittleDragon

Moshi Moshi from LittleDragon
5 years 39 weeks ago, 7:40 AM

Nitris

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yes there junk

Nepal Says Indian Rifles Malfunctioned During Battle
By VIVEK RAGHUVANSHI, NEW DELHI

An Indian Army official said Aug. 15 that his country’s soldiers have reported problems with the Indian Small Arms System (INSAS) 5.56mm rifle, which the Royal Nepalese Army is blaming for the high number of casualties its forces suffered in a recent battle with Maoist rebels.
A diplomat of the Nepal’s embassy here said Army leaders told authorities in Kathmandu last week that the rifle developed problems during long battles with Maoist guerillas, adding that the Army has declared the rifle to be substandard.
Reuters reported Aug. 12 that 75 Nepalese soldiers still were missing following an Aug. 7 Maoist rebel attack on an Army camp in northwestern Nepal’s Kalikot district, in which 43 soldiers and one civilian were killed. The ensuing battle continued for 10 hours, the report said.
“Soldiers complained that the INSAS rifles did not function properly during the fighting, which lasted for a long time,” Brig. Gen. Dipak Gurung, the Army’s spokesman, told a news conference, according to Reuters. “Maybe the weapons we were using were not designed for a long fight. They malfunctioned.”
An Indian Army official said Aug. 15 that in the past, major defects with the INSAS rifle, such as cold arrest, breakage and cracked components, have been reported in high-altitude operational areas like the Siachen Glacier and Kargil. Other reported defects of the gun have included broken or cracked carrying handles, butt locking screws, retainers and barrels.
An official of India’s Icchapore Rifle Factory, which makes the guns, said that the INSAS rifles are not substandard. He said the guns could have failed due to poor maintenance by the Nepalese Army.
Nepal’s Army receives most of its arms, ammunition and training from India, which has supplied more than 100,000 INSAS rifles to the service at a 70 percent discounted price.

Ron Paul 2012 III
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